Citroen XM Forum

http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1098 ... suspension" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Sad news, but long predicted.

Hydropneumatic a fabulous system, but only when it's all working perfectly. Judging by the numbers of Xantias, XMs and others seen jiggling about on the roads, over the normal (let alone classic) working lifetime of an hpn car, there is plenty of scope for things to repeatedly deteriorate, and either require expensive dealer maintenance, or not be maintained, and for ride to become dreadful. Either way, it could leave owners less than impressed, and that has an impact on marketability.

Add to that PSAs determination to eliminate costs wherever possible, and the hpn system was always under threat.

Magneride is really clever, and open to extensive control, but is only a variable damper system. Still leaves the gap of constant or controllable ride height, though.

Would PSA ever allow Citroen to seriously innovate in this area again?

Although I have run them since the CX and thier high speed ride is superb, they have never been very good about small bumps at low speed, except perhaps the DS, that was superb. The problem now is that people or at least manufacturers want cars that will corner at 60mph and break your spine on bumpy roads, hydrophumatic doesn't fit that scenario. Shame.

Peter

I think its more that with a modern chassis and squeek free cabin accompanying modern suspension technology the same ride comfort can be achieved at a fraction of the production and maintenance cost so its a no brainer.

I don't subscribe to the idea Citroen killed it, its had its day and there are better alternatives on the market now.

D

Dean wrote:I think its more that with a modern chassis and squeek free cabin accompanying modern suspension technology the same ride comfort can be achieved at a fraction of the production and maintenance cost so its a no brainer.

I don't subscribe to the idea Citroen killed it, its had its day and there are better alternatives on the market now.

D

Technically, not so. The fixed volume gas spring has a lot of advantages over both metal springs and variable volume air springs....but the system is more expensive to produce and requires some maintenance, which car drivers are unaccustomed to having to do.
I agree abut the sharp bump transmission, but that just needed dealing with, as has been done on the C6.

Upmarket Mercedes cars use a system very like Hydractive 3...except it is a lot less reliable.

Obviously it is the manufacturing cost that is the issue, but if it was marketed better it could have been seen as a worthwhile bonus. Car buyers have now accepted air springs, but they don't offer such good body control, due to lack of progressive rate and such systems tend to be unreliable due to compressor or bag failure.

Technically not so your right, but the margin between modern sprung cars with improved refinement and hydractive is so small its not really worth it at all for the masses.
Air suspension was always rubbish in my view, air bags and compressor units going, there is no doubt whilst requiring preventative maintenance hydraulics are actually very reliable.

The death of hydractive can only be good for the long term price of hydraulic Citroens at least

D

Citroen did a lot of clever and worthwhile things, but not always marketed well, if at all.
When the cars only needed to be sold by the tens of thousands, perhaps this didn't matter: there were always enough Citroenistas around to secure sufficient sales.
Nowadays, it's all different. Cars need to be sold by the million, and much of the buying public will spend more time in choosing a washing machine or phone than a car. As Peter says, their expectations are similar.
Only a tiny number of car buyers actually do any research when buying: look at how the lack of a spare wheel caught thousands by complete surprise, and how diesels are summarily dismissed by many, for reasons which were given currency in the 1950s!
Technical excellence and performance often count for little among the wider public. My guess is that Beko outsells Bosch, even when the prices are a smidgen apart.
A not-too-ancient 4WD Toyota sits outside, and is a good workhorse. Although we look after it, and it's hugely dependable, it's not something that we get very excited about, and certainly not the basis of the absorbing and mind-stretching hobby that the XM provides.
The owner's sites are good, but ours is - believe me - something else.

Dean wrote:I think its more that with a modern chassis and squeek free cabin accompanying modern suspension technology the same ride comfort can be achieved at a fraction of the production and maintenance cost so its a no brainer.

I don't subscribe to the idea Citroen killed it, its had its day and there are better alternatives on the market now.

D

There is a modern car that rides like an XM?

Peter

The sad end of an era in automotive engineering, but not just yet for me. I guess the XM will survive among a tight group of enthusiasts for another decade or so. Unfortunately Citroen has not been able to convince the public nor PSA with the C5 and C6. That's what an over engineered unreliable product does.

Peter.N. wrote:

Dean wrote:I think its more that with a modern chassis and squeek free cabin accompanying modern suspension technology the same ride comfort can be achieved at a fraction of the production and maintenance cost so its a no brainer.

I don't subscribe to the idea Citroen killed it, its had its day and there are better alternatives on the market now.

D

There is a modern car that rides like an XM?

Peter

I was staggered at how well the coil-spring C5 Mk3 rides. Mind you, I was even more staggered by how utterly dreadful the Cactus' suspension is.