Over Zealous MOT Testers

[robert_e_smart]

Morning Chaps,

Last night I took my 2.5 for its 3rd MOT test, after it failing its original re-test because I pulled the ABS warning lights out to turn the ABS warning off. Only myself to blame this time.

I was expecting a standard test, and the car to sail through. But my stroke of bad luck began, by having the same prick that broke a rear brake pipe on my Bx Estate last summer as my tester.

So he failed the car for the following reasons:

A track rod end - Fair enough, but their equipment shake the hell of the car, and that made it fail.

The rear brakes needed excessive pedal effort applied before they would be operative- This is the bit I don't understand. The brakes passed the original test, the brakes were tested again on the re-test and passed.

ABS failed to operate on road test- I can't argue with that, it didn't work, but in the normal run of testing, they never take cars on a trial. This is the first time I have had a car taken for a test-drive ever, and I MOT around 4-5 cars a year.

I haven't made up my mine yet whehter I am going to re-test it or not. I might be getting a 2.5 Estate, and this could be a handy spares car. They can't all be saved.

How can I get the ABS to operate? Is it the ABS ECU that is at fault? The VAG ABS sensors I fitted, not being completely compatible, even though the ECU self tests correctly, and displays no warning lights during normal use of the car.

For the rear brakes, I was planning on cleaning them up, and filling the boot with 25kg bags of cattle feed, so there is more weight on the back of the car, thus more braking effort supplied to the rear brakes.

Robert

[Ciaran]

Take it to Boucher, they'll pass anything. Well, they're a lot more lenient than Lisburn I've found. Bit of a trek for you mind.

That's a real pain, 3rd time failed, sounds like the guy was very over zealous indeed. I know what you mean about the test equipment, it really does hammer the shit out of cars, especially the suspension test (not so bad in a Citroen), and the ramp that lifts it and twists the steering etc. My cousin had the brakes in her 306 (well serviced) fail five minutes after driving out of the place a few years ago, on the motorway....

The rear brakes I'm surprised at them even mentioning, its well known the effort is significantly reduced when there's no weight on the back of the car, but I've never had that commented on with any hydraulic Citroen before, sounds like this guy is just a bit of a dickhead.

Mines due up this time next week and I'm dreading it. Typically, I've had intermittent ABS warnings while driving, just spring up over the last few days, after years of it never appearing, it has to start doing it the week before the bloody test!

You could try a different ABS ECU I guess... OR, put it in for a full test (so the ABS failures wont be on any retest sheet), at a different centre where they don't know the history...

Ciarán

[robert_e_smart]

Yeah, its a bastard.

I look it to Lisburn orginally on the way home back from collecting the car, and I was surprised at how short the fail sheet was.

Then back to Newry for the re-test, the guy was very reasonable, and was doing his job correctly.

Then Armagh last night. I'm not taking any cars back there again. Even though I tested the 2.1 there in December, and had no problems.
Normally Armagh is Ok, but its this parcticular tester, and now on my second run in with him, enough is enough. I'm sick of spending money on MOT tests, thats £80 it has cost me, and it still failed.

I nearly would go up to Boucher to get it tested, if it means a trouble free test, then its worth the journey. I was nearly considering Lisburn again after the first test, but if you think Boucher is better, its worth a shot. I am now tempted to partake in that Citroen free MOT offer. Get Hursts to test it, and see if it passes.

We'll see what happens, I haven't made up my mind yet.

Robert

[citroenxm]

1994 2.5, so I guess then thats a Bendix system!

Johns the best ABS man I think, he will be back on later this evening, as he was up here last night, and going home today.

Paul

[Peter.N.]

Hi Robert

I would find another garage, my chap is brilliant, although Dorset might be a bit of a journey for you. He is never 'picky' but he tells me of any real faults, I take it home and fix them, I take it back and he gives me the MOT, no hassle.

Peter

[robert_e_smart]

I wish it was that easy Peter,

Our MOTs are carried out by Government run test centres, that only do MOTs. So we can go between centres to get tests, but there is no opportunity of building a rapport with a particular garage/tester over the years like you can have.

[XMX]

Hi ciaran

...................OR, put it in for a full test (so the ABS failures wont be on any retest sheet), at a different centre where they don't know the history...
Ciarán

I wouldn't be so sure ? Personally I think they can see anything if they care to look (Just as we can)

Did you not read this posting:-

Just in-case XM Forum member's/guest's don't go on the BXC of FCF !

I thought I'd post the same here as I've done on the FCF to make every-one aware !

The Post which I made (Copied/pasted from the FCF ) :-

Hi Xac,
I tend to agree with you !

Its worth going for the free MOT, even if yours isn't due for 6 months. If it passes, you've got 12 months until your next MOT. If it fails, the expiry date on your current MOT doesn't change and you can consider this a free inspection.

If your car fails, you no longer have a valid MoT as your car has been deemed unroadworthy.
With it all being kept on database these days, I'd think it'd be harder to get away with showing the original MoT if stopped.

If you take a look at the same post/discussion on the BXC and especially the quote (By ed4ferrets) which I've copied and pasted below:-

The entire computerised MOT history shows, fails, advisories, the whole lot 8). Always handy to know what previous owner/s didn't bother to mention (possibly) needed doing for the next MOT

Just try it out, especially if you have a vehicle which you've owned since 2005 (Hopefully you may remember all the 1st passes or second attempt re-test you've had) I'm sure you'll all be impressed with the info the VOSA data base holds/reveals about it

So before you part with your hard earned cash on your next second hand car purchase, (If the vehicle has/had an MOT) ask the seller for the reg. number (If your not aware of it) plus the Document Reference Number from the V5C

I hope this may be of use !

XMX

The above quote taken from THIS thread.

Robert,
I was disappointed that the ABS - VAG mod, didn't work out as I was hoping it did because my friend 2.5 TD has developed a ABS warning light display/failure and that has the Teves set up and not the Bendix one, I wonder if it's that the VAG ones (Similar to the Teves one) pull approx. half the resistance of the Bendix ABS sensors and as your 2.5TD use the Bendix ones which may be causing the light to re-appear, as my initial thought after your post of the sudden braking you had led me in thinking it could be the ABS Reluctor Ring that may have some teeth corroded/missing which could fooled the ECU a little that you were about to lock the brakes, but as they were the rear sensors which are enclosed in the trailing arm housing that closed out that thought !

I may see if I can source a good VAG one from the breaker's and try and adapt it for my friends 2.5 TD (front wheel/exposed position) which is fitted with the Teves ABS sensor's and see what the result's are, as those have very similar resistance values.

Have you or any one near you got a good/known Bendix ECU to try out to see if the ABS behaves in a similar after your repair/mod before you give up on the car ?

XMX

[robert_e_smart]

Hi XMX,

The ABS Ecu that was in the Onyx should be compatible. I'll give it a try. I remember comparing them, and the numbers on them matched.

I don't know if the VAG sensors are to blame here or not. Davetherave is trying it out on his car, at the moment, and had different problems from me. I'll stick in the other ECU tonight and see whether that would make a difference. I wonder if my apparent lack of rear braking effort can be linked to the ABS. Certainly the tester was trying to suggest so. But he knows nothing about Citroens; when I drove into the centre, he was querying the rear ride height as being a bit funny. It was normal.

I hope its not the sensors, as I think it would be an excellent fix for XM owners. But it might be a compatability issue with the resistances from Teves and Bendix.

As for finding a working ABS sensor in a breakers, I would be inclined to buy one of the new sensors for a tenner. What are the breakers going to ask for one, not to mention time saved not having to go to the breakers, also will it corrode in like on the XMs?

I'll be interested to hear what John has to say when he returns.

Robert

[Ciaran]

Hi ciaran

...................OR, put it in for a full test (so the ABS failures wont be on any retest sheet), at a different centre where they don't know the history...
Ciarán

I wouldn't be so sure ? Personally I think they can see anything if they care to look (Just as we can)

I'm not sure if the same is true for the MOT stations over here, as they operate differently to the system of garages in the UK, I don't know if the cars history is immediately available or has to be dug up. Certainly on the screens which are at each test station, it displays the cars details, numberplate, registered address, status of currently tested item etc, but I've never seen them show anything about previous tests, and most of them are readily visible.
I could be wrong though, hope not
With our government places, there's always the chance that the tester can't be arsed checking the details, which works in your favour sometimes.....

Ciarán

[minijet]

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ABS failed to operate on road test

This is news to me. I thought they didn't test the ABS in the MOT, that's why they rely on the ABS warning light.

Paul

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