Citroen XM Forum

Just wanted to do a straw poll of how people do hill starts with the lovely foot parking brake (especially if there's someone right behind you). Seems to me you can either
1. heel 'n toe it
2. jump quickly from the footbake to the throttle
3. let the parking brake fly off (heaven forbid!)

Cheers
Andrew

So exactly what's wrong with releasing the dash mounted hand lever and letting the foot pedal spring off - that's what
you're supposed to do? Whilst I realise some don't like the noisy springing up of the pedal its preferable to doing what
probably 90% of other road users do out there; sit on the brakes and scrabble for the clutch whilst rolling backwards
momentarily - it's usually a monster 4x4 with Outlaw or Warrior in foot high lettering or an impossibly large ugly people
carrier lifestyle statement.

Andrew

Hi.

I ride the clutch!! And I've done it all my driving life and never burned out a clutch yet and if I do use the hand brake it just springs out when I release it, but I never use it at stop signs or whilst driving.
Bob

I'm with Andrew especially as I'm getting used to the bite point for the clutch on the XM

The only people it upsets are those unused to being passengers in am XM who think the exhaust has just fallen off

Well I don't want to start an argument but, anyone with experience of engineering would know that letting the parking brake off suddenly so that it crashes against the stop is not going to be good for it. I always ease mine off using foot and hand.
Andrew

Ah, i rarely use the handbrake at junctions.

Even when i set off from being parked i always put my left foot on the park brake while i release it. You can even hear the bang outside the car if not! So i dont often let the brake bang into the off position.

At junctions I usually sit with my foot on the foot brake and as im setting off lift the clutch slightly while putting my foot back on the accelerator. I never get the car to roll back, if your quick you dont. Though i do this in every car, not just since driving a manual Xm either.

The bang isnt the reason i dont use the Xms footbrake at junctions, but to use it you need to press the clutch, take it out of gear, press the footbrake, engage the dash mounted lever, put your foot back on the clutch, get 1st, get the bite point and then let off the lever. If your in crawling traffic thats impossible to do quickly. Though i do use the Xms handbrake on the steepest of hills, as you cant not.

I never ride the clutch, this drives me mad. I sit there going into Newcastle City centre every day while people round me are riding their clutches for ages and ages while in stopped or crawling traffic. On some occasions you can smell their clutches. A clutch is like a brake pad, drive around using the brakes hard and they will wear thin in no time, a clutch will wear thin with lots of use too. So Bob, im amased you dont get through clutches on piece doing that. I know people who ruin clutches in under 40K miles by doing this, so you cant ride it too often, or Xms have very strong clutches!

I know people are often taught to do that in their driving lessons, but its not good driving and an advanced driving test would not be passed by using such a technique, its most certainly a fail.

My mum wont even drive the manual Xms, because she doesnt get along with the parking brakes. It doest bother me though, and with a little practice you can become quick at using the parking brake, though you still have to let it bang into off. MOre recently ive been using the parking brake more at junctions where im stopped for a while.

Still, its why we love these cars and their mad quirks

Chris.

Edit: trust me to have an impossibly long post, as usual

I've known others drive an Xm the same way with a feathering of the floor pedal release by having a foot
damping the release. I'm not sure it can some to any harm mind, the spring is sufficiently strong and the
pedal bracket and the stop aren't thin metal so not something that would fatigue and fail. If you're using
a foot on the release pedal as it springs off, I'm guessing the clutch would be already engaged with the
same foot so the clutch is being slipped far longer which sounds more like wear I'd be trying to avoid.

I've mentioned many a time in the past, I do find the foot operated handbrake handy when I DON'T want
to broadcast I'm braking say for example on a dual carriageway in front of an approaching policecar or
waiting in a long que of cars decending a hill approaching lights/junction. The foot operated system needs
to be very robust so I'd expect it will be brick outhouse engineered as in extremis it's the last and
only way to stop a car that's lost it's pump and hyraulic pressure say possibly due to a snapped aux belt
wrapping around the timing belt. In the CX, a reserve brake sphere of pressure for the brakes allows the
car to safely stop when all else has long gone south - been there done that!

The Cx actually has an appalling handbrake which may have something to do with the design engineers
building in a decent factor of safety and probably why the handbrake on it's replacement was something
a great deal more thought was applied. A direct foot operated cable link to the lever of the caliper on
the Xm means your full body weight and mechanical advantage can be directly applied in an emergency,
not something as likely on a conventional lever operated by hand.

Andrew

No, when i have my left foot on the parking brake to release it quietly when im setting off from rest on a flat road i dont have the clutch engaged. Im not sure if its possible to have the clutch engaged and to use the same foot to slow the parking brake I have my right foot on the brake and then set off as i would at a junction, releasing the brake and going straight on the acclelerator. Actually its not somethin give ever thought about doing, just happens

When i do hill starts it has to go off with a bag. Cant see it doing any damage it just sounds like its falling apart if you have people in the car

Im going to give myself a challange to use the parking brake more often and not sit with my foot on the brake on steeper junctions. Will see how i get on

I agree Andrew, its handy to slow the car if you dont want your brake lights to come on

Chris.

I'm sure I've mentioned this before Chris, I didn't realise you were as high up to Newcastle as it sounds,
I thought you were in Durham? I was born and raised originally in Ashington - just north from Newcastle
and I still badly miss my original roots in Northumberland - head and shoulders above South Wales and
the people are more mellow/chilled there too.

I'm surprised you manage to find a hill in Newcastle, Wales has all of them!

Andrew

I can't even think how the foot pedal could be damped with the clutch foot, accelerator applied to prevent stalling
AND the clutch being brought up to engage all at the same time on a hill start - no wonder some folk speak of needing
3 legs when criticising Xm handbrakes; they're doing it wrong!!

If it were such a big deal damping the noise of the sprung off pedal, maybe an opposite spring or a rubber buffer on
the stop could be employed? I don't mind it personally.

Andrew